GLOSSARY
Peru glossary

Luis

(PERU 3)

Sex	male
Age	64
Occupation	judge/comunero
Location	Quiulacocha
Date	1995

transcript

Section 1	How old are you now, Señor Luis Celis? I'm 64.
	Were you born in Quiulacocha? Yes señor, I was born in this community. I grew up here and here I’ve had my family and built my life. I've always lived in Quiulacocha, for so long that they gave me a position of authority among the Quiulacochans. I'm the son of this land, I work here and here I'll die señor.
	Oh right. You’re part of the authorities, how interesting! What job do you actually do? I'm justice of the peace here, in Quiulacocha, in the district of Quiulacocha, nominated by my people.
	Very interesting... what does the role of justice of the peace actually entail? To ensure justice among the people, señor. I was nominated justice of the peace, to see... how do you say it....to administer justice in the district. When there are problems with neighbours, when there are disputes, fights and things like that you see señor.
	It’s important for us to know what relationship your position as justice of the peace has with the formal systems of justice, I mean with the judicial power of the Peruvian state, and with the legal systems that, since time immemorial, have existed in communities such as Quiulacocha? Well señor......
	For example, who nominated you as justice of the peace? The community elected me, I'm part of the community authorities, yes señor, it was the community and I form part of the governing body, like the president, treasurer, spokesperson etc......
	So what you’re saying is the position of justice of the peace has been incorporated into the community’s organisational structure? Yes señor, it forms part of the community now...
Section 2	Do you remember if this role existed before, when you were young? Not really, I don't think it existed. I don't remember which year we created the post in the district of Quiulacocha. It was probably when the community of Quiulacocha was elevated to the category of a district.
	And do you remember how they used to administer justice in the Quiulacocha community before? It was always through the community authorities: the president, with the most authority, and his governing body decided on such cases. Now it’s the justice of the peace, but he consults members of the governing body, now that the judge himself actually forms part of the community’s governing body.
	So it’s as if the community fitted the justice of the peace into the judicial systems that already existed in the community? Whichever way you look at it, the community is the most important level of authority for the Quiulacochans. A real Quiulacochan must respect the community agreements, the laws of the community which are the highest command. Quiulacocha has been around for many years now, since before the time of the Spanish. What's more is that it was in these mines that they found "el paco" (mixture of gold and silver). Daniel Alcides Carrion’s father worked here. Here, the father of Daniel Alcides Carrion, the famous Quiulacochan, married a young girl from Quiulacocha after they'd fallen in love. So it was here that Daniel Alcides Carrion [father of Peruvian medicine] was born and now there's a house built as a reminder of his life here in Quiulacocha.
	*Of course you are proud that Daniel Alcides Carrion was born here, one of the most famous doctors Peru has ever had. But tell me, what's "el paco" - we don't know, we don't understand?* Paco was a mineral, like a parcel they got out of the mines, a mixture of gold and silver. The Spanish extracted it and the Gringos (westerners, foreigners, in this context North Americans who ran the mines) did too. There's always been a wealth of minerals here. In Yurajhuanca, they are still extracting the remains. Here in Garga, they are getting gold and silver. Before, they used to get gold. That's why people came from abroad, starting with the Spanish, That's how Quiulacocha survived - it was a bustling village... That's what makes us Quiulacochans...
	Can you tell me if the productive activities of families living in Quiulacocha have changed over time, or are they the same? Quiulacocha's a livestock-rearing community señor. The men here have always dedicated themselves to rearing animals. With time, they have also become traders, of meat, wool..., agriculture a little less but ...we've traded with other communities nearby...
	What are the main animals you keep here in Quiulacocha? In Quiulacocha, it’s wool-giving herds and cattle; now there's also llamas and alpacas - this is what there's most of in the farming community of Quiulacocha.
	And the activities, the work, has it changed? Some still remain, a lot’s still the same, señor.
Section 3	What kind of work don’t you do anymore? I don't know, I'll have to think. I don't remember so easily... agriculture, before they used to grow more potatoes but there's not very much of it around in Quiulacocha any more.
	Why's that then? They used to fish as well before, in the lake and rivers.
	There were fish in these lakes? Mr journalist, I remember a lot used to come from Cerro de Pasco and here as well. We had to catch lots of frogs and take them to the people of Cerro de Pasco. There were birds, lots of birds typical to the area, but now they've disappeared as well. These birds no longer exist, the only thing that still exists is the seagull and there's not very many of them around either. You used to find trout, frogs and the people ate fish, all this has changed, señor. You don’t find trout around here any more. You have to go and buy it. Before you could find it all over. Frogs as well, you can't get anything now. And it’s because the waters are dirty, now you can't fish and you can't eat these things here any more.
	Has this affected the typical foods eaten by the community? You can't get these things here now but you can buy them in Cerro - trout and frogs, that come from other places, places where they farm them I believe.
	What new activities are there, which weren't here before? Just what I've already told you. They are traders as well, teachers, bakers in the new bakery in Quiulacocha, that's all I think.
	You are someone who's lived a great deal. Were your parents also from Quiulacocha? From the heart of Quiulacocha señor. My father and my mother were born, grew up and died here in Quiulacocha.
	And what did they tell you about the Quiulacocha community, about life here before? Many things, I don't remember everything. But they talked of Quiulacocha when it was really old... of their parents, the family... just about this, I don't really know [what else] ... about "el paco" and the wealth of these lands. These lands form the mining capital of Peru.
	But is mining an important activity for the people of Quiulacocha? For some people, not all...There aren't many, but there are people from Quiulacocha who work in the mines...
	Do the miners help out in the community, do they bring any kind of help to the community? They work for themselves, just themselves, they sometimes work on the faenas (community, communal work), but just to feed themselves señor.
Section 4	Approximately how many families live in Quiulacocha? There are currently 290 comuneros on the official register, but including all their families, you would have to multiply it by three. There’s quite a lot of people here, señor.
	If we say about 870 people.....out of all these families, how many are mining families? Well, there are very few mining families now. Since 1970 the companies haven't been taking on workers. People here are more involved in rearing animals, señor.
	The people who work in the Centromin mines, do they go everyday from Quiulacocha? All my fellow villagers who worked in the mines, even those who have retired, would leave from here everyday at six in the morning to arrive at work by seven, señor.
	Has there always been mining in this area? Since the arrival of the Gringos from the Corporation there have been huge operations in the mines. Before that I wouldn’t know. [Cerro de Pasco Corporation arrived in Peru at the beginning of this century].
	Talking a little about the history of mining here in Quiulacocha, how long have there been mines around here? In Quiulacocha? When I was born in 1929 there’d been a mine near Quiulacocha for ten years although it was being dismantled then. This was to become Cerro de Pasco, close to Colquijirca, and from here they moved it to where Cerro de Pasco is now.
	*Did you know the Gringos?* Yes we knew them from the Corporation... from when the Corporation was here you see. We worked with them señor.
	Surely they must have brought some improvements to Quiulacocha? Not at all, the Gringos didn't bring us anything. On the contrary, they took all the wealth from our lands away. Mining in Quiulacocha hasn't brought us any improvements. From the time the Gringos arrived up until now, we’ve got nothing from the company. It’s only because of our own efforts that the community is getting back on its feet.
	*But didn't the Gringos* install the water that you have now, the drinking water?** The water system was done as part of an agreement when they were changing over (nationalising) señor, it wasn't with the Gringos.
	*But what about electricity - wasn’t it the Gringos* who brought that in?** The electricity came as the result of an appeal. When the Corporation was here, one of the comuneros, God bless his soul, worked incredibly hard to get us electricity. Señor Valentino Lopez made a huge fuss to get electricity, señor, because we were living... we had to ignite a tiny little machine to get light in the community - there was nothing else.
Section 5	*During the last few years of the Cerro de Pasco [Corporation], when the Gringos* were going to go, did the community agree that the Gringos should go?** Well, we couldn't do anything about it when the sale went through because they hadn’t told anyone in the community that they were going to sell it, that they were going to change it to Centromin Peru.
	*Was it the Gringos* who contaminated the water?** It was already polluted then, the Quiulacocha lake was contaminated from a long way back. It was before then, from the time work began in the mines, that’s when it started to be polluted. It’s a long time now señor that Quiulacocha lake has been polluted. There used to be two mining works inside the lake. Now all you see is the waste they left behind, covering up the lake. And you can see how close the lake is to the village of Quiulacocha, can’t you señor.
	What benefits have you received from the mines being here - from the mining companies Cerro de Pasco Corporation and Centromin? The only benefits we’ve had from them are a few old tin roofs, a few bricks, that's all the benefits we’ve had from the company, señor.
	Has Centromin brought any developments to Quiulacocha, has there been any kind of development or modernisation [from the company]? It’s just like you see here, señor. We simply live as campesinos, there aren’t [economic] improvements for us. Maybe if people like you, people aware of the pollution that exists here, if they’d have come earlier, then possibly the contamination could have been controlled. That's why I want to let people know about what’s going on here, so that they can install some kind of [pollution] detectors to make things better, so that we can do away with all this environmental pollution, señor.
	Besides Centromin, what other mines are there around here, close to Quiulacocha? As I said before señor, they’re working close to here in Yurajhuanca, mining gold, silver and also mercury. In Garga, they were extracting, but not now because the mine was shut down about 10 years ago. That mine, that smelter belonged to Mr David Rojas, the engineer, but it’s not operating anymore for financial reasons. Thirty people used to work there before you know, just in the plant, and another 30 were involved in all the other mining activities. I guess these 60 people must have gone elsewhere now though. But if there’d been a big investment, señor, this smelter would still be working.
	You’re saying then that people have been laid off in the mines, that mines have been closed. How has this affected the population of this area? A lot have been laid off, there are less miners here than before. Like I told you, there haven't been any new jobs for years.
Section 6	What do the majority of the people of Quiulacocha do [for a living]? Well, in this community like in any other community, we have workmen, campesinos, mainly livestock rearers, and people who work here in [the town of] Cerro de Pasco.
	Have you, as a community, ever gone in for mineral extraction? The people of this community, señor, have never gone in for extracting minerals. We are herdsmen and we are workers; some people work at Centromin; this is what we do here señor, nothing else. We’ve never gone in for mining as a community, we’ve left this to the big companies - it needs a great deal of money.
	And from what you’ve seen, has the community changed much during your lifetime or compared with what your parents told you? Yes, of course, there are [lots of] new things.
	What do you think has changed? What customs, what kind of things did you use to do but don’t do any longer? There are things that are no longer customary around here, for example, the fiestas (festivals, celebrations) they have changed; the faenas of the women washing their clothes on Sundays, a delightful custom that we had before señor, I remember it from when I was a child... the fiestas...
	Tell me about it. On Sundays families would go down to the river señor with all their clothes to wash. The whole family [would go] and all their friends. But that’s when the waters were clean. They would spend the whole day there doing their washing, everyone would help each other out (faena), everybody would be partying. They’d bring a lamb along and they’d cook the lamb on a spit and they’d cook their traditional dish, pachamanca (meat and vegetables cooked in underground ovens), and they’d celebrate with their maize wine, their chicha (liquor made from maize), the children would be playing... when it wasn’t raining. Everybody was happy then, some people used to fish, catch trout and then toast them. It was really beautiful, señor, the whole day was beautiful....
	Are you saying that it doesn’t happen like that any more? Not nowadays, no, because no one wants to wash their clothes in the river - the river is pure filth. If you want to find a fresh spring, you have to go further out, further away and it’s not easy to get there. There are none of these days out any more, señor, now the people just go to Cerro, that's all.... Here we've got the river San Juan, which is polluted as I told you before, which flows down from Cerro de Pasco. Before, this lake, which you probably saw when you were coming down in the car - it is because of this lake that the community gets its name, Quiulo - cocha (cocha means lagoon). In those days there were lots of seagulls around, and all kinds of bird and animal life. But not now, there's none of this now, señor, now that the river is so polluted.
Section 7	Are there other lakes here in Quiulacocha? Yes, there’s Cuchis Grande, Cuchis Chico and Antaloma - these lakes are polluted too with acids thrown out by Centromin Peru.
	And when did all this begin to change, señor Luis, with the pollution? I guess it’s since they built the new plant and did all the extensions. All the filth from the mines comes down to us here since our community is right in the middle. So it’s ruined this custom of the washer women. What's more, they say that simply touching the water can be bad for your health and if you wash your clothes here, they’ll come out dirtier than before. You can't do it anymore.
	And you don't remember what year this might have happened, when the Quiulacochans stopped going down to the river to wash their clothes? It would be about 1960, or a little after, if I remember rightly.
	What other customs do you remember that still go on now or that have changed with time? I don't know, I think its just this one, that's all. We still have the fiestas, they celebrate the national fiestas a lot here, in this village there's the Baile Viejo (The Old Dance), which they do every year on the national feast of Saint Sebastian. Children even do this dance, the Baile Viejo, señor.
	How does it go? It’s an old dance from the region where you dance in pairs. It’s really lovely, it’s for the feast of Saint Sebastian. You would have to see it... it’s the same for the feast of the child Emmanuel which takes place in December.
	Can you explain to us something about the feast of the child Emmanuel? It’s during the month of December and we celebrate the birth of the child; all the community gets together to celebrate and... that’s it
	Is it the same as Christmas, do you mean the celebration of the birth of Jesus, the son of god? That's right , the son of god.
	Do you know why they call the child Emmanuel? No, I don’t know, but here they call him Emmanuel, that’s what he’s been known as all my life, señor.
	*Talking of fiestas,* are there any others you remember from your childhood or that you’ve experienced?** I don't know señor, maybe...I don't remember.....
	What about weddings in the community, what are they like, do they celebrate? Of course, they have beautiful celebrations. The families get together with friends and they have a big fiesta.
Section 8	Big? Several days? Yes, sometimes the couple leave and the people go on celebrating for several days.
	And weddings when you were young, what were they like? Was your wedding different from your children's? More or less the same señor. They were better before, there were more resources, more money, more animals to be sacrificed. Today people are poorer and as they don't have so much livestock, they celebrate less.
	What about the ceremony, and how they become officially engaged, how the girl is asked for her hand... have these things changed? It used to be mainly people of the same community who married each other, is that the same now? That has changed now of course. Before, the man presented himself to the woman and asked her to marry him and then the relatives would decide if the future husband was in a position to set up home. The woman would also come into the marriage with her possessions, cattle, parcels and things like that...It was like that, the families knew each other. So they weren't strangers and all this. People would also come from outside the community to ask for a bride, like Daniel Alcides Carrion’s father who married a young girl from Quiulacocha and made his home on these lands.
	And what happened to men, for example, who didn't own anything? If he didn't have anything, then how was he going to support the woman? The families wouldn't allow the wedding to go ahead...
	And if the couple got married anyway? If they didn’t get the approval of the family, they would just live together anyway.
	Has this changed, señor Celis. Is the custom different now? Now things are less formal, señor. The young people get together and that’s it. We have this custom of servinacuy (co-habiting before marriage) where a couple will live together for a trial period, and that’s fine; others go off to marry elsewhere. Girls leave the community to go to other places and come back engaged...
	Talking a bit about migration, do people from Quiulacocha go to live elsewhere? Well, its like in any other community, there isn't much work and so they go elsewhere. But people my age who live here don't go anywhere. We're doing our little bit sowing grass and rearing guinea pigs, that's what I do, raise guinea pigs and sow grass.
	Young people leaving the community, señor Celis, is this something new? Less people used to go before, now many more do. They go to the cities to seek their fate.
	What do you think is the reason for this? There's little work here in the community and the young people are more adventurous. They think they’ll find something better in the capital; some of them don't like the country, and to work rearing cattle, they prefer the city. They also go to Huancayo, they go into business or find work in whatever it might be. Even the really young ones go, they work in the cities and, like I told you, they come back engaged, with their children and nobody knows who they are paired up with or anything. Sometimes they return destitute and they either go back again or they stay.
Section 9	Do you have children Señor Celis? Yes, I have six children who are grown up now, señor, and 25 grandchildren.
	And have your children also gone from Quiulacocha? Just two have stayed. The rest are in various places, señor. One works here in the jungle, two are in Huancayo and one in Lima. Here I've got the youngest and my daughter who married here in Quiulacocha. She’s given me three grandchildren. All the rest are in Lima and Huancayo.
	And how are they doing? Why do you think they left? They're doing well, they've got work, that's the main thing, señor. They’re in a difficult situation but they have learnt their trades and they're doing okay, taking care of their children. One of my other daughters has married in Lima and she doesn't have to work, her husband’s the one who works in construction. Civil workers they call them
	Civil engineers? That's right señor, the ones who build houses and buildings like the ones they have in Lima, for people to live in. Sometimes there's work, sometimes there isn't.
	When your children went, did you talk with them, about why they were going, did you give them advice? Well yes, its the duty of a father to advise his children, to teach them. They went because they wanted to trust their destinies to a different direction, different from the community and the work here, they wanted to learn professions, to continue studying - here they don't teach beyond primary.
	There's no secondary education here? .....At first they were going to Cerro, and then further away. There's less happening here, less prospects, that's for sure, señor.
	Less than before, less than when you were young? Yes less, and the future of Quiulacocha isn't secure either for the young people. For the old people like us yes, because we're just going to die.
	And why is the future so uncertain? Because they tell us that they're going to move the community lands. They’re talking about moving us to other places, maybe Cerro or I don't know where. Here everything's polluted and they say it's getting worse all the time and that its getting so bad that it’s a health risk. It affects the livestock and so I'd say there's less future than before, when the pollution wasn't as bad. Now there's no water señor, so what can we do? There won't even be any for the animals to drink. That's why the people, our children go away. To explore, señor. Also, if it doesn't go right for them, if they don't like it, they can come back and their land, their home and their family are here to welcome them.
Section 10	Would you be in favour of them exchanging the community land? I’ll believe it when I see it, señor. But I won't see it happen. It will happen after I die, I bet. That's what I think. And if it happened now, we'd just have to get on with it, we would go with our things. We've lost our land once before already.
	What do you mean? When we started the communal cooperative of Quiulacocha, I think that was in 1970. They gave us 7,500 hectares under law 17716. Then we had a battle with the campesina community of Yanahuanca and they took away 1000 metres of our land. But our community, as brothers, we didn't want to become rivals with any other community, because we know we are working together and we are united as comuneros (registered community members with rights and responsibilities) and as campesinos. What I would like to do, señor, is make an appeal to all the powers that be in the government, that they support all campesina communities equally, because we are brothers, we can't fight with anybody, señor.
	With which of the neighbouring communities do you develop joint activities? In this community we concentrate on our own activities. There have been times, months after the pollution started, when we joined up with Yurajhuanca, Champamarca to make a stand against the environmental pollution. The pollution is destroying our houses, our children, everything, sometimes we’ve drunk polluted water and this has caused tooth decay in all the children and old people, señor. [The interview was interrupted and they returned 15 minutes later.]
	Picking up the theme of migration again Señor Celis, didn't you want to leave [Quiulacocha] when you were young? I did my military service in the jungle. I was away two years doing service, señor.
	But you came back? I came back, señor and I had my family here. I liked the land and I truly didn't think about going elsewhere.
	How old were you when you married señor? Twenty two, señor.
	Did people get married so young? That's right señor.
	And is your wife also from Quiulacocha? Yes, señor.
	People who leave Quiulacocha to look for work in other places, do they come back? Yes, as I told you earlier, they have to come back, for example, from Lima when they can’t find work. They have to come back to their homes, from where they’re from, and when they’re older then they turn to rearing cattle, don't they? In the old days we had lots of fresh water, but now Centromin Peru has polluted all the water from Cuchis Grande and Cuchis Chico. That's why now, wherever you go, people are going away. But with the little we have in the cooperative, they come back to find refuge and work in the cooperative. [The interview was interrupted because we had to move from the community hall which was about to close. Later we took up the interview again in a restaurant in the plaza]
Section 11	And tell me Señor Celis, did the organisational structure of the community change during all this time, from what you remember? Its just the same...the campesina community of Quiulacocha is organised in a way very...I mean it’s got a President, an administrative council, a Vicepresident and it’s also made up of the Communal Cooperative of Quiulacocha which also has its president, auxiliary helpers... there’s also the town council of Quiulacocha.
	*The cooperative and the municipio* (local council) were created later and have been incorporated into the organisational structure of the community, isn’t that so?** The Quiulacocha community, following a motion taken at their assembly, founded the cooperative, I don't quite remember in what year, in 1970 I think. And it is this cooperative is that develops activities in the community for the [economic] benefit of all its members...the communal cooperative was founded back then in 1970 with just a few cattle. These days it’s got wool-producing animals, brons cordeal (?), and for cattle its got some brons suizo (brown swiss); there are alpacas and it’s also got trucks, a fork lift truck....
	Is everybody here a member of the cooperative? We have 190 comuneros, out of these 190, 176 are now members. But as I was saying before, if we get that help from the government - if only we do! - we’re going to try and get everyone from the community to become members so that we’ll be able to use all the land, señor.
	What do you need to be a member of the cooperative? To be a cooperative member, you need to have been a comunero for five years and from there you become a member of the cooperative.
	Do you remember when the district of Quiulacocha was formed? Not very well señor, I just remember that, you would have to look at the documents, my memory is failing, at my age...
	When decisions need to be taken, how do you do it? For decision-making we have the general assembly as the top authority. We don't make community decisions on our own, it’s not like that. When there is a conflict about land, or when there are other conflicts, the general assembly has the power, as I said before it has the authority.
Section 12	How are you doing with your own work, what are you rearing, is it just livestock, how's the work been going up to now? I've been doing this research now since 1974, because there’s hardly any support from the government, there isn't much help from the community and there isn't much help from the central offices. But anyway, as a comunero of this village, I have done my bit towards planting grass and looking after guinea pigs, and with this I have brought up my family. Now I’ve just got a few guinea pigs of my own to take care of, señor.
	You don't get any help from government? We managed to get a truck from the government and then we got some alpacas. We have asked for support to upgrade our school which was started two years ago but we still haven't received anything. What I would most like would be for them to give us enough money for the 13 August School. It was called 13 August because Daniel Alcides Carrion was born on 13 August in Quiulacocha.
	Going back to the environment, can you tell me what substances have polluted the lakes? Firstly, as I told you, when Centromin dumped all its waste in the lake, Quiulacocha was the first to be contaminated environmentally. But nobody came here, no journalist. I'm grateful to you for coming here to spread the news of how the pollution got here in the first place. The pollution has come from sulphated water and it’s the sulphated water that has killed all the frogs and the birds that you don’t see around here anymore.
	Are the contaminated lakes still used for anything? Now, señor, as I was saying, our little animals always used to drink from here, but quite a lot of animals have died since the first reactive chemicals were dumped. A lot of animals died but nowadays they just don't produce wool or they’ll get thin if they drink the contaminated water.
	Do the animals still drink this water? Yes, they drink this water señor, that's why, when the politicians came from Lima we showed them everything that was polluted... the contaminated lake where our animals drink, but they didn't take any notice. The pasture land is also polluted because the fields get flooded by the sulphated water and all the grass gets burnt, its all burnt señor. The air as well. It’s what I was saying before señor, our old people, our young people are all [suffering the effects of] the pollution. That's why we want you to spread this news around - do it as much for the young people as for the old - maybe central government will take more notice...
	What happens to the children? What illnesses are they getting? The children have a lot of cavities, you know, bad teeth. I guess because they’re young, they don’t have problems with their hearts, or their lungs. But before long, a highly dangerous epidemic could break out, maybe among the older people who already have bad teeth and some of them have lost all their hair you know. All this is a consequence of the pollution, señor.... Since I was a child, there’s been this problem, and it’s something to do with the wind which now we get in the summer. When it’s foggy, when it’s windy, all the chemical dust from the mines is blown onto the roofs and its destroying the roofs.
Section 13	You have been affected quite significantly by the pollution caused by Centromin. What have you done to defend yourselves against this? Señor, we have met with the Minister, all of us together, but he didn’t take any notice of us. And it’s going to get worse because they’re going to dig a canal which will pass through Quiulacocha, you can see it here, everything is going to come now, waste waters from Cerro de Pasco are going flow down here to Quiulacocha you see, and its going to be even more polluted.
	Are you saying that Quiulacocha is going to be doubly contaminated? They are contaminating everything day after day. Nothing is done about it. We have been to the Prefecture, we've been everywhere, but we still haven't found a solution.
	Have you been to court, have you won any cases against Centromin? We still haven't won a single case as I told you earlier, señor. We haven't got enough money to see us through a court case.
	What benefits have you received, or what compensation has Centromin paid you for having contaminated your lakes? Very little really. Recently they've been building a park here you see? A sports field, a sports complex... Then, as I said before, señor, they were going to install drinking water but the company didn't have any good technicians, and we still haven't got drinking water because after that there was another job which is the milking shed, and that still isn't finished. This is all the help we’re getting, señor.
	How do you regard the current situation within your community? Well, at least these days we think we might be able to do a bit better with some help from the government. They gave us a truck, a few alpacas - with this we can overcome the problems more and more, señor. I only hope the government will continue to support the campesina communities, señor..
	How do you see the future of your community ten years from now? Like I told you señor, if we work hard, if there is support for the campesina communities be it in guinea pigs, chickens or pigs, a few small animals so people can work, possibly in groups, we could advance in every community. But, señor, we still don't have that kind of help, and with this type of help we also need trained people, so they can teach the relevant technologies, señor.
	What do you desire most for your community? What we need most in this community is more livestock, better livestock, this is what every person needs, señor. If there is an improvement on the part of the company, in relation to the pollution, then that would be better for our own futures and that of our grandchildren, señor. I've got a number of grandchildren in Quiulacocha, others in Lima and in Huancayo and it would be lovely if they could grow up and come and visit me in Quiulacocha in the summer. This is what I would like, but not with this filthy air that will cause them harm. This has got to change for there to be a future in Quiulacocha, like you say, señor.
Section 14	Would you like to add anything to finish up this interview, señor? I just want to thank you for coming to this campesina community of Quiulacocha where Daniel Alcides Carrion was born. Take our regards and I hope that these words will help people wherever you go to understand more about our community and the problems that all the members of this community want to overcome. We are not just asking for help, what we want is the opportunity to make up for lost time and for us to become a prosperous community like Quiulacocha of old...